Lascivious vs. Affectionate

How nice would it be if we could solve all the male/female communication problems right here on Twenty Four At Heart?  Or maybe just minimize the gender gap somewhat?  Earlier this week I opened a can of worms when I discussed (here and here) an article I read which stated men read sex into the majority of female communication. 

The posts brought forth a lot of emotion and a lot of varying opinions.  Some of it was funny, some of it was angry, and some of it was heartfelt.  Every comment and every email I received made it very clear to me that the sexes are miles apart in many ways.  I hate to speak in generalities, but in a blog forum, I have to.  Individually you and I could sit down and discuss particulars, but I am not able to do that here.  That's disclaimer number one.

Disclaimer number two is that I have always had a fair number of male friends.  I attribute it to growing up in a neighborhood with a lot of boys and very few girls.  I relate well to men.  That being said, I have many platonic male friends even now.  If I'm misguided in regard to those friendships (and I don't believe I am), I'd rather stay oblivious and continue viewing them in the light I currently do.

Disclaimer number three:  To my male readers ... I am quite sure that you are all wonderful partners to your significant others.  None of the generalities about men in these gender gap posts are pointed at you specifically, so please don't get defensive.  I am quite sure you court your loved one with sweet words and tender touches and that none of this applies to you whatsoever.

OK, have I covered my ass now? 

To the female reader who asked me why men like blow jobs?  I am not a man, so I can't speak for men.  If I had to hypothesize, I would say because it feels good.  Just a wild guess.

Regarding the question about butt cracks possibly interfering with the style/look of your dress when you go commando, I refer you back to my response in the comment section of yesterday's post.

To all men everywhere?  There was a recurring theme in the feedback I got from women.  We hate to be groped.  Hate it.  I'm sure you never do this, so please tell all your male friends who may not be as enlightened as you are.  When we are standing in the kitchen slaving over lovingly preparing a meal for you, don't walk by and squeeze our ass so hard we jump in the air.  Also, we aren't cows and don't get turned on in the least when you can't resist reaching out and squeezing our tits hard enough to milk us. 

Not that Briefcase has ever done anything of the sort.  Ahem ....

Men?  What is it with the groping?  Is it a turn on for you?  Or do you mistakenly think you are turning us on?  (You're not, I guarantee it!)  It reminds us of 6th grade when 12 year old boys would sit in a corner pointing and exclaiming, "Look, boobies!" and then try to cop a feel as we walked by.  The groping needs to cease and desist.  It's in your best interest, I promise.

Willy wagging.  Just.Stop.It.  Shaking it at us?  It's not a turn on.  You may find it highly amusing to touch your junk, shake it around and chase us around the house.  It does not increase our libido, okay?  Not in the least.

The crude comment.  If I say I'm thirsty, and you reply with a smirk, "Oh I can give you something to drink."  Do you think I will reply, "Great idea, thanks!?"  Is that what men perceive as foreplay?  Do you think I instantly appreciate the suggestion to quench my thirst and get all excited thinking about it?  Because, if so?  You're mistaken.  I received lots and lots of comments from women regarding their frustration with the crude comment.  By the way, a little dirty talk at the right time is not the same thing.  Two different entities.

Groping, willy wagging, and the crude comment are all aspects of male behavior that women would like to see disappear.  If you are a man and you want to leave a comment and tell me how your wife/girlfriend gets turned on when you say something crude to her out in public, wag your willy at her at the dinner table, and then honk her tit as she walks by, then fine.  There are exceptions to every rule.  But my guess is that you just think she gets turned on by it.

Women stated repeatedly they don't get nonsexual affection from their significant other.  "Why can't he give me a hug without turning it into a grope?" was a recurring theme.  Holding hands, hugging, touching without sex, was high on my female reader's wish list.  Nonsexual physical contact seems to be something women crave, but don't get.

Now that we've talked about a few things women don't like, I'd like to hear from my readers what they do like.  What does foreplay mean to you?  I'd like to hear from both men and women.  What gets you in the mood?  What would you like to see your significant other do?  What makes you feel romantic?

Comments

[Midlife Mama]

What a great post!! Thank you, thank you, for speaking up for women all over America today.

And what men don't realize, is that if they laid of the boob honking and other groping, and substituted nonsexual affction, that we'd be more inclined to "get in the mood" for sex.

Foreplay for me is 1) spend time with me during the day. Make me feel important to you. If you ignore me during the day and only pay attention to me when you want sex, that makes me feel like a whore. An unpaid whore. Not conducive for good sex. 2) Don't get mad when we say no. Even worse is threatening to "get it from someone else" if I don't "take care of you". That does NOT help. Has it ever worked? NO! Duh! 3) Don't expect us to look or act like porno "actresses." Don't expect us to have sex like them either. It's a fantasy world, NO ONE has sex like that except in porno movies. Get over it. No, I DON'T want a little girl-on-girl action; get over it!! 4) Don't "honk" our boobs a couple of times in bed and them move south. TOO SOON!! Spend more time kissng and caressing north of the border. Believe me, it will pay off. 5)If we don't like the taste of the "protein" and don't want it in our mouths, don't make a big deal out of it. Otherwise, we won't give you head because we're afraid you won't respect our wishes by "showing" us how it's really not that nasty. Believe me, we've had it, and yes, it is that nasty. Get over it.

Bottom line: Treat us with respect, with love, and lots more romantic stuff (wine, music, candles) and we're much more likely to respond to you. Coming up behind us while we're standing at the sink and "humping" us and honking our boobs does NOT turn us on. Even worse? Grabbing a beer out of the fridge and vegging on the couch while we finish dinner and the dishes after we've both put in a long day a work just pisses us off. A pissed off woman doesn't feel like having sex with you.

Oh, and don't beg or whine. It doesn't become you. You really don't want pity sex do you? Okay you probably do so don't answer that.

We need to feel emotionally close to you and important to you to even think about being intimate.

That's my two cents worth!!

[Midlife Slices]

Foreplay? What is foreplay?

[amyz5]

you are hysterical and so right on (i see a graphic here for your motto, i will email it).

refraining from writing a full blog post as a comment i would say that women (in general – disclaimer, disclaimer, disclaimer) need the emotional tie to lead them to the physical turn on.

unless, or course, you are looking for the occasional simulated zipless from the man you are hopelessly zipped to.

[Tricia]

My idea of foreplay has changed over time, considerably, but it never has and never will include the kind of groping others have described. Foreplay can be as simple as an invitational kiss and other times it can be a day-long affair that gently builds anticipation. It depends on my mood as much as it does his.

[Donna in VA]

Well said! Excellent. Now if the men will just listen.

I don't remember foreplay. But I do know that I am more apt to get more excited if he just spent some time with me (nonsexually) before he decided to jump me.

Excellent discussion. I can't wait to read your comments on this.

[Donna in VA]

Well said! Excellent. Now if the men will just listen.

I don't remember foreplay. But I do know that I am more apt to get more excited if he just spent some time with me (nonsexually) before he decided to jump me.

Excellent discussion. I can't wait to read your comments on this.

[Jan]

Hey, look everybody! Twenty Four At Heart has turned into a short European woman named Ruth! :P

You're opening up a can of worms with this one but okay, here goes.

I know what he wants, but the older I get, the harder it becomes for me to wield a bullwhip with the kind of precision necessary to avoid serious personal injury and an increase in our homeowner's insurance premiums.

As for me? I'd just like to make a few things clear:

1. Darling, if you want to get jiggy with Jan, do not turn on the television the minute we walk into the bedroom every night. The World Series of Poker is not a recognized aphrodisiac. At least not in my house.

2. This is my body. As tired and rotund as it may be, it has more than 3 erogenous zones. Please do a little exploring - I will draw you a map if necessary.

3. This sort of goes along with #2, but do you see these? They're breasts, and while they may not be as perky as they once were, they are still pretty honkin' big and consist of more than just the nipples. Which, by the way, are not radio dials.

4. Of the many things I love about being female, my ability to have more than one orgasm during sex is not the least of them, trust me. However, that being said, 2 is great, 3 is fine, but a marathon attempt to coax 15 out of me over a period of 3 hours may leave you thinking you deserve some sort of an award, but it merely leaves me tired, sore and wishing you'd watch the World Series of Poker.

Okay, flame away, male readers. I can take it.

[Midlife Mama]

What Jan said.

Bottom line here: Do you get in a car and expect it to go without turning it on first? No, of course not.

Same thing with women. You need to turn us on first!! :-)

[Alntv]

Foreplay? What is that? It DOES go both ways...right? Because as I get older...it would be nice to get a little foreplay every now and then...

But I'm a guy...so I don't need it, right? I mean, I should be able to whip it out and make it work on command...right?

Not. It goes both ways ladies...and that's the facts!

[Lynn K.]

I agree with Midlife Mama and Jan, they both said everything I had to say way better than I could.

I do want to say that I get lonely for nonsexual affection. I miss the handholding and hugs, and just sitting together. A hug early in the day does not mean I want sex now or later. It just means I need a hug.

And maybe that would be my idea of foreplay....nonsexual touching can be quite a turn on, you know.

[amyz5]

wait, you girls don't get turned on by the world series of poker...

[kelly]

Can we print out this post and give it to every man when he turns 18? Or sooner? How about a little flirting all day long? Sex is mental too, but they never seem to bother ....

[Mike]

It goes both ways. I used to get back rubs and massages. What happened to that ladies?

[Mike]

It goes both ways. I used to get back rubs and massages. What happened to that ladies?

[Lori]

What a great post about a great subject...and the comments...I love it all.
I pretty much agree with everything that has been said already. Even though I love sex it does not turn me on if I am being grabbed and sexually touched all the time. I need non-sexual attention too.

One of my biggest turn on's is when my husband does things around the house(like cleaning, laundry or cooking) when I haven't asked him too...or fixes something that I mentioned needed fixing and then just does it. Another big turn on is when he has a really good conversation with me...like when he talks to me about something he is passionate about. Another big one is when he takes over the kids for me and I get a break from the constant caregiving. Add to that, seeing him with the kids and how great he is with them...showing his soft or playful side.

When he is playful with me and enjoying a good laugh...that can really do it for me too. Probabaly the biggest one for me is when he makes me feel like I am beautiful and desirable.

I think what it all comes down to is women like to feel connected...and desirable and respected and beautiful to their man. I think men might need this too but they don't voice this as much as women do.

[vodkamom]

hmmmmm let me think on that one. I like to have a conversation, have a great, great laugh together, cuddle, and then more cuddling, and then....

wait, gotta go.............

[Jason]

All very interesting.

The bottom line is, in general, I think men treat women in a way that they themselves would probably like. A grope? Yeah, I think most guys would be happy with a grope. A totally sexual, non-emotional, down and dirty grope is what lots of guys like.

Bottom line is, men and women are so very different. And the only way to overcome those differences is to communicate clearly about what each person likes and how to meet in the middle so each one gets what they need.

And why do guys like blow jobs? Yes, because it feels GREAT! And besides feeling good, it is exciting. And that's where I'll stop. Before someone accuses me of turning into Dr. Ruth, too.

[Jason]

By the way, I also need emotional connection. Very much so. But it doesn't necessarily have to go hand in hand with sex.

[Kristan Hoffman]

You know, these women should probably be emailing their signifcant others -- or better yet, talking in person -- instead of you. :P

Speaking from experience, those conversations can be (i.e., ARE) a HUGE pain in the butt to have, and someone will usually end up crying (probably the girl but not always), BUT if you don't have them, you're always going to have this divide. Why not TRY to meet each other in the middle? And maybe sometimes each partner should walk completely to the other side. A little groping won't kill us ladies, and a little non-sexual romance won't kill the lads, I'm fairly certain.

Maybe I'm being too idealistic/optimistic, but I really think a lot (not all) of couples could work out a lot (not all) of their problems if they would just talk to each other about them first.

(Disclaimer: Okay, yes, I'm only 22. But I've been trying this with my bf and we haven't killed each other yet!)